Ep. 197 Mel Robbins Says It Takes 200 Hours—Here’s Why Fifteen Seconds Can Ease Midlife Loneliness, Calm Anxiety, and Reduce Stress

Can fifteen brave seconds really be enough to move you out of loneliness in midlife?

You’re not alone—many people feel stuck in midlife loneliness while also battling anxiety and stress.

In this episode, you’ll discover:

1. Why Mel Robbins’ 200-hour friendship rule doesn’t capture the reality of connection in midlife
2. How self-knowledge and social intelligence can make friendship easier and quicker to build
3. Why anxiety—not time—is the real barrier, and how just fifteen seconds of bravery can help you break free from loneliness

🎧 Take 10 minutes to see how one brave choice can ease midlife loneliness, calm anxiety, and reduce stress—you’re worth it.

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About the Host:
MJ Murray Vachon LCSW is a Licensed Clinical Social Worker with more than 48,000 hours of therapy sessions and 31 years of experience teaching her Mental Wellness curriculum, Inner Challenge. Four years ago she overcame her fear of technology to create a podcast that integrated her vast clinical experience and practical wisdom of cultivating mental wellness using the latest information from neuroscience. MJ was Social Worker of the Year in 2011 for Region 2/IN.

Creating Midlife Calm is a podcast designed to guide you through the challenges of midlife, tackling issues like anxiety, low self-esteem, feeling unworthy, procrastination, and isolation, while offering strategies for improving relationships, family support, emotional wellbeing, mental wellness, and parenting, with a focus on mindfulness, stress management, coping skills, and personal growth to stop rumination, overthinking, and increase confidence through self-care, emotional healing, and mental health support.

Transcript

M.J. Murray Vachon LCSW: 0:00

In this episode, you'll discover why building friendship in midlife can actually be quicker and easier than you might think.

MJ Murray Vachon LCSW: 0:08

Welcome to Creating Midlife Calm, the podcast where you and I tackle stress and anxiety in midlife so you can stop feeling like crap, feel more present at home, and thrive at work. I'm MJ Murray Vachon a Licensed Clinical Social Worker with over 50,000 hours of therapy sessions and 32 years of teaching practical science-backed mental wellness.

M.J. Murray Vachon LCSW: 0:32

Welcome to the podcast. Today I'm taking on the research that says it takes 200 hours to create a close friend, and let's be real. If you're in midlife, where would you ever find 200 hours? In this episode, you'll discover why the so-called 200 hour friendship rule may not reflect the reality of midlife. How your self-knowledge and your social intelligence make creating friendships easier. And why The true obstacle to feeling less lonely and having more friends isn't time. It's anxiety. On Monday's episode, I invited you to write down three communities that you've been part of and bravely reach out to a few people to reconnect. I hope that exercise sparks something in you, maybe a sense of warmth or even a little ache. That's because belonging matters. But if it also made you feel anxious, welcome to the club. That's totally normal. And today we're gonna talk about how to step into connection. Even if you feel anxious about it. Let me begin with a story from the couch. Right after New Year's, I started with a new client. She was struggling with loneliness and isolation. She told me it was feeding her depression and even her weight gain. She said, I've always had friends, but some have moved. Others are so busy with their grandkids and there's no school activities pulling us together anymore, sound familiar. It reflects what's happening nationwide. So many people in midlife are lonely because the structures that once gave you automatic connection. School, church, neighborhoods start to fade, then my client came to a session in mid-February and she was completely dejected. She had just listened to Mel Robbins podcast on friendship and said it takes 200 hours to make a close friend, 200 hours. I can't even imagine how I'd ever get out of this loneliness, if that's what it takes. Her words captured what I've seen so many times in midlife, the fear that friendship is outta reach, that the mountain is just too steep to climb. I. And listening to Mel Robbins and the research that she talked about on that podcast was not helpful. Let me share with you that research out of the University of Kansas, which suggests it takes about 50 hours to make a casual friend, 90 hours to move into friendship and 200 hours to reach close friendship. Now, this is interesting research, but here's where I completely disagree. Those numbers may apply to college students or young adults, but in midlife, your story is very different. Why? By now you know who you are. You know your values, your boundaries, And the kinds of people who bring out your best as well as the kind of people who bring out your worst. I have used a simple exercise with clients and students thousands of times to highlight social intelligence and friendship. I give them index cards with five words. Facts. Interests, opinions, emotions, and values. In your twenties, you're still figuring these out. But by midlife, you come to friendship. Fully baked. And here's the beauty of this exercise. It shows you that friendships naturally exist at different levels. some are facts and interest friendships. Maybe you play pickleball. Follow the WNBA together or do volunteer work. Those friendships matter, but close friendships, they're the ones where you share opinions, emotions, and values. They're the ones where you are authentically you. They're the ones where you feel safe enough to be your most authentic self. One of my students once said, close friends, get the inside stuff, the invisible, but connecting parts of us. So let me ask you think of one current friendship. Is it mostly facts and interests, or do you also share opinions, emotions, and values? Do you feel authentically you and here's the truth. In midlife, you don't need 200 hours. Often, you know within a few conversations if someone's a good fit. Last winter I was at the gym and struck up a conversation with a complete stranger. Within minutes, I thought, this woman has soul. She connects deeply. As I walked away, I thought maybe I should ask her to coffee. Immediately another voice piped up that's weird. You just met her. But I realized that was fear talking. So I paused, took a breath and pushed through. I asked her, wanna grab coffee Sometime eight months later, we've shared maybe 35 hours coffee walks and great conversation, and I consider her a good friend because we share facts, interests, opinions, emotions, and values in a mutual way. Slowly as we spend time together, I can see us sharing more of our authentic selves with each other. Friendship in life isn't built by default. It's built by design nine. So if time isn't the real issue, why does it feel so hard? It's anxiety. Anxiety that suggests you'll be rejected. Anxiety says you'll be awkward. Anxiety says it's safer to stay busy than to risk reaching out, but once you notice that anxiety, you can name it, tame it, and then aim it toward connection. My client didn't need 200 hours. She needed one brave hour. Well, actually, to get to that one brave hour, she just needed 20 brave seconds, just like I did in the gym. When I pushed through that voice that said, this is weird, That's how belonging begins in midlife. So this is a new way for you to think about friendship. When you hear 200 hours, it can feel overwhelming, like another impossible task on your already too long to do list but when you look at creating new friends with a midlife perspective, it's simpler. Be clear on who you are. Be clear on what type of friendship you're looking for. Be brave enough to move through your anxiety and be intentional. Remembering that friendship and midlife isn't created by default. It's created by design. This combination makes friendship not only possible, but often quicker. Deeper and more meaningful than you would expect. And yes, my client did find her way out of loneliness. She admitted it. How brave of her realized. It was structural, not personal. How often are you blaming yourself for something that has nothing to do with you, but the structural changes that have occurred with your life? When you do the update, it really cuts down on self blame. My client made a list just like Monday's Inner Challenge. And on it was book club from 15 years ago. She tracked down one woman and sent her a text inviting her to coffee. She told me I was so nervous, but nervous is better than lonely and depressed. The friend immediately responded, and they met that week. Both were in transition, both craving connection. Mel Robbins attributes the difficulty in making friendships to what she calls the great scattering. Yes. We live in a very transitory culture, and our family and friends are scattered all over the place. That is real. But in midlife, when you decide to create new friendships and step past your comfort zone, you often will experience a different kind of scattering new people, new communities, and new opportunities. Yes, anxiety shows up. But remember, it's just a sensation. Your body is saying, this is new, this is uncomfortable. And in midlife, you can trust yourself. You can say, I can do hard things. I've got this. So today you've discovered why the 200 hour friendship rule doesn't really capture midlife. How clarity about who you are and what kind of friendship you want makes connection easier and why the real barrier isn't time, it's anxiety. if you want my one pager on Social Intelligence, basically a visual summary of this episode, send me an email. MJ at MJ Murray von.com. And here's the line I want you to remember. Friendship in midlife isn't built by default. It's built by design. Thanks for listening, and I'll be back on Monday with more creating midlife calm.