Ep. 74 Mental Wellness & Hedy Schleifer (Part 2)

In this podcast episode,  MJ continues a conversation with Hedy Schleifer, an internationally renowned relationship builder and motivational speaker. Hedy introduces the latest iteration of ECT (Encountered Centered Transformation), emphasizing that peace begins with the family through strong, committed partnerships. They discuss the process of hosting and visiting different 'neighborhoods' within each other's worlds, both precious and challenging, and explore concepts like generative speaking and listening, the Hero's Journey, and the importance of maintaining a sacred space. Essential insights on relational growth and longevity are shared, focusing on deep connections within families and communities. Special thanks to Elly Wynia and MJ's grandson, Neel, for their contributions.
Website: https://hedyschleifer.com/
Ted Talk: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HEaERAnIqsY

00:00 Introduction and Recap
01:09 Understanding Precious Neighborhoods
03:06 Generative Speaking and Listening
05:55 Exploring the Neighborhood of Challenge
11:13 The Hero's Journey
15:01 Making Requests in Relationships
20:15 Creating Sacred Space
33:05 Final Thoughts and Insights



Creating Midlife Calm is a podcast designed to guide you through the challenges of midlife, tackling issues like anxiety, low self-esteem, feeling unworthy, procrastination, and isolation, while offering strategies for improving relationships, family support, emotional wellbeing, mental wellness, and parenting, with a focus on mindfulness, stress management, coping skills, and personal growth to stop rumination, overthinking, and increase confidence through self-care, emotional healing, and mental health support.

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About the Host:
MJ Murray Vachon LCSW is a Licensed Clinical Social Worker with more than 48,000 hours of therapy sessions and 31 years of experience teaching her Mental Wellness curriculum, Inner Challenge. Four years ago she overcame her fear of technology to create a podcast that integrated her vast clinical experience and practical wisdom of cultivating mental wellness using the latest information from neuroscience. MJ was Social Worker of the Year in 2011 for Region 2/IN.

About Inner Challenge:
Inner Challenge was created in 1995 as a summer camp for girls, and spent 20 years being tested and "refined" by junior high students who insisted on practical Mental Wellness skills that made them feel better. Inner Challenge has been used in many businesses, and community organizations. In 2017-2018 Inner Challenge was a class for freshman football players at the University of Notre Dame. It was these students who encouraged MJ to face her fear of technology and create a podcast. Inner Challenge will soon be a Master Class available for those who want to stop feeling like crap.

To connect with MJ Murray Vachon LCSW, learn more about the Inner Challenge or inquire about being a guest on the podcast visit mjmurrayvachon.com.

Creating Midlife Calm is a podcast designed to guide you through the challenges of midlife, tackling issues like anxiety, l...

Transcript

Ep. 67 Mental Wellness & Hedy Schleifer (Part 2)
[00:00:00] 

MJ Murray Vachon LCSW: Welcome to the podcast. Today we continue our conversation with Hedy Schleifer. 

MJ Murray Vachon LCSW: I know that I'm supposed to make every episode be able to stand alone. And I imagine this episode could stand alone. But if you haven't heard episode 66, I really encourage you to go back and listen to that first. Hedy is an internationally renowned relationship builder and motivational speaker. She and her beloved husband Yumi are the founders of ECT Encountered Centered Transformation. A process rooted in her belief that peace begins with the family and it's best achieved through strong, committed and growing partnerships of all kinds. In our conversation, Hedy is sharing with us, her new iteration of ECT. In episode 66, she gave us an introduction and we stopped at session three. Let me just tell you, you may never meet her. [00:01:00] You may never sign up to do ECT with her, but just listening to these two episodes can make all your relationships in your life better. So, let's pick up where we left off. 

MJ Murray Vachon LCSW: So, what's next? ? 

Hedy Schleifer: Three to ten, people learn to host and visit. Hosting, I'm inviting you into my world. Visiting, I'm coming over the bridge to your world. And they host in neighborhoods. Imagine there's a big world called MJ, it's filled with neighborhoods, even neighborhoods you don't know, right? It's the mystery of being MJ. Your world is expanding because you're so ready to learn and know more and embrace more, so your world is expanding. It's filled with neighborhoods and we're going to go visit neighborhoods. The first neighborhood that I go with couples to, I call a precious neighborhood. A precious neighborhood is where you feel excited, energized, [00:02:00] inspired, creative. You feel in your essence, that's a precious neighborhood. For example, a precious neighborhood is what I'm telling you about now. A precious neighborhood. And we have many. The reason I start with precious neighborhoods is because, number one, it's easier for me to teach hosting and visiting in a precious neighborhood, because then we're going to go in a neighborhood of challenge and it has its own challenge. A precious neighborhood, I can teach visiting and hosting. Number two, the precious neighborhoods are the resources and strength of the relationship. And so, it's 

nice to begin with a resource. Because we want to go to neighborhoods of challenge, but let's do a resource first. And so, people learn how to actually visit each other in a precious neighborhood. The host invites, I'm inviting you to cross the bridge, MJ, and come to me. I'd like to [00:03:00] explore a precious neighborhood of my world with you. So that's the invitation. You learn how to come over that bridge. And then I teach what I call generative speaking and generative listening. 

Hedy Schleifer: Generative speaking is the following. I explore in many words, whatever I want to say to you, but then I say to you and what I want to say to you is, and I say it in five words or less, meaning the core essence of what I just said. Because what it does is it generates for me the core of what I'm trying to say to you. And it's generative speaking because suddenly there'll be something new I've never said before. If I dare to do that and each time go to the core. I will say something that I just discovered, and the reason for the visit is to discover the new. To find something I've never spoken before, I've never understood before, I've [00:04:00] never said before. That's hosting. Generatively speaking, till I find something new. Generative listening is leaving my world completely, coming to be with you, bringing my full attention, my full focus, my full curiosity, my full compassion to you, but leave my neighborhoods in my world. Be fully present. And what do I do? I repeat the five words or less. So, I hear you say that you are most alive when you think. I hear you say, am I with you? You say, yeah. And then you say, tell me more. And it's still, I feel complete because something new has emerged. And that's the visit. And we do it on both sides. They discover hosting, visiting. But they also discover a strength and resource in each other that they've not known that way. And the host [00:05:00] discovers something inside of them they've not known. 

MJ Murray Vachon LCSW: I love the word precious because it immediately connects us in this light, soft being type of way, which is the essence. And I love the five words. 

Hedy Schleifer: Five words or less. I can say, and I'm so happy. I'm so happy. You see what I mean? That could be the essence. So, it's really learning to go to that essence. 

MJ Murray Vachon LCSW: Yes. How is the essence different than one's core? 

Hedy Schleifer: Here I'm saying it's the essence of what I'm saying we get to one score by going to essence, suddenly something new emerges that's deeper, that's more of who I really am. 

MJ Murray Vachon LCSW: It's like stars, essence, you put them all together, you have a beautiful night sky. Beautiful. Beautiful. Then what? 

Hedy Schleifer: Session number four, the visit to the Neighborhood of [00:06:00] Challenge. Now, for the Neighborhood of Challenge, I give two metaphors. Before we start, there's always a little bit of a conceptual lesson, and here's the lesson on the metaphors for the neighborhood of challenge. 

Hedy Schleifer: One metaphor is the trays. In, in cafeterias, you've got tray mechanisms on spring loaded, and you can't take out a tray from the middle. You have to take the first one, and then they all come out, and the second one, and they all come out, and the third one, they all come out. And I say when you go into a neighborhood of challenge, you want to trust every tray. 

Hedy Schleifer: Whatever shows up, go with it, so that you can get to tray number 17 that you've never seen before. It will only show itself if you take number one, number two, number three, and your partner is going to be listening to you in that generative way, the way you've learned last . The tray is one metaphor. The other metaphor comes from the [00:07:00] book by Otto Scharmer Theory U. Otto Scharmer is a developmental organization person. Theory U is developed for organizations, but is an organization of two, right? Here's what he says that when there is a problem or a challenge, we would love to jump from the problem to the solution. But he says it's impossible to do unless you go down the U, to the bottom of the U, and that's when the future will start calling you in a different way if you dare to go to the bottom of the U. 

Hedy Schleifer: At the bottom of the U are the toughest feelings you've never basically expressed. Unless you go there, the future won't call you in a new way, and the solution will never show itself, he says. There are artificial solutions we can do, but it won't be the real thing. I say to the couple, we're going to go [00:08:00] tray by tray, down the U, to the bottom of the U, and then the future will call, and you'll hear it, because it'll be something totally new, a new solution, a new idea, a new way will show itself. So, the host invites the partner to a place of challenge, challenging the relationship. And they trust to say. everything The partner's learning to just be there. And it always gets summarized in five words because it's tough to hear all of it, but the five words, I get scared of you, could be the five words. I hear you say you get scared of me. Am I with you? Yeah, tell me more. Down the U, down the U. Usually at 

the bottom , you find a child. Find yourself as a kid. I was scared of everyone. I didn't have a place as a child, and tears. At the bottom of the U [00:09:00] is often our childhood story. The toughest feelings we've ever had that we began to describe about our partner And about our relationship, on the bottom, it goes there. Just the other day, the woman who, on the bottom of the U, remembered age 14 being sent away to boarding school, but really rejected and not having anyone to share that feeling of loneliness and rejection and pain and no need can be met and wanting to hide all this, bottom of the U. Her partner who's there, suddenly says, Oh, this challenge has got this little kid in there, like it becomes so clear. Then the future starts calling, Oh, I think I need to speak my needs with love. Like the future begins to say things. I've been so tough with my needs, but I want you to listen to my needs, but I need to speak them. The future start calling and then you follow that [00:10:00] and coming up the U, you start building a new possibility in the relationship. 

MJ Murray Vachon LCSW: Wow. 

Hedy Schleifer: It's very powerful because people have gone down to U that way with each other. The whole session, one person hosting, one person visiting, and when the future starts, I write everything because when the future starts calling, I have those notes and I will give it to them. This is the way the future started calling. You saw that girl and you knew what you need now and how you need to ask for it. That's session number four and five. 

MJ Murray Vachon LCSW: Wow. 

MJ Murray Vachon LCSW: They are really in a very new place. Sometimes I'll say, can you both write a letter to that girl in the, in the boarding school? Each of you write her. We met you today and we love you. This was not right. You should never have been sent away that way. I don't always have an assignment, but this is asks [00:11:00] for it. Do you know? 

MJ Murray Vachon LCSW: That was four and five or five. So, one person, one week, the other person, the other week down to you tray by tray and then comes what I call the Hero's Journey. But here's how we do it. I say to the couple, one person will host, invite their partner and when you say I'm with you, I'll grab the first memory of my childhood that shows up when you say I'm with you. 

Hedy Schleifer: Oh, wow. 

Hedy Schleifer: First memory. Because interestingly, it's different. It's not stuff you think about often. Okay, you grab that memory, and then the partner visiting that for that session has a lot of work and I'll tell you what it is. The first thing is to tell the story of their partner in the third person from the time they were born, or even before. Once upon a time, a student in college fell in love with another student, and they were so in love, and then they left each other, but they found each other again and [00:12:00] they married, and guess who was born, a little boy called Andrew. You tell the story till the memory, whatever you know till the memory, then you put the memory in one day, then you finish the story because you'll see that now you have a theme. 

Hedy Schleifer: If you go from birth to the memory, you'll already have a theme and then you finish the story with that theme. And I say to them by the time the story is done, we'll have an archetype. The other day I had the archetype of a brilliant young girl who took care of her mother and took care of her father and took care of her brother, and took care of the family, and made sure everything's okay, and was in charge of everything at age 10. She found a way to go and visit her mother at the hospital. Nobody told her how to go there, and nobody told her where mother was, but she found her. This kind of archetype. She's not the first girl in the [00:13:00] world who does her life alone and takes care of everybody. At the end of the story, you'll have an archetype. If you got to know the archetype. There's many choices you have, that's the hero's journey, that we are and what we didn't do. Once we had that, the partner who told the story is going to come in with a time machine, because in the 21st century, there are time machines. The partner will take a time machine to the age of the memory, let's say 10, talk to the mother They'll talk to the father, and they'll say all the things the child never heard anybody say and then they'll talk to the partner. I'm your future, I'm gonna marry you, I know you're just 10 years old, you think this is crazy, but I came from the future with a time machine to meet you because I've talked to your mom and I've talked to your dad and now I'm talking to you and I want you to know you have a right to play. You're 10. 

Hedy Schleifer: This is so important for you to be able to [00:14:00] play and to be protected, gives me goosebumps now because I'm remembering the husband saying that. And then they say to the child person, have I said everything to everyone you'd like for me to talk to. And then the child often sends them on missions, or even to themselves. 

Hedy Schleifer: Come back to me and tell me something about my future. That's going to be okay. Whatever. And the partner says it. Then they say, and now I'm taking my time machine to go back to the future. I'll meet you there. May 22nd, 2024. I'm going to meet you there. But before I go, is it okay if I 

give you a big kiss on your forehead? And you've got the partner giving the little one a big kiss on the forehead. they meet in the future and they tell each other what was most moving about getting into the hero's journey and finding the archetype and speaking to all the important people. 

MJ Murray Vachon LCSW: That's brilliant. 

Hedy Schleifer: Have you forgotten where we are now? [00:15:00] Four, five, six, seven. Seven is about learning how do you make a request in a relationship? How do you invite your partner to a core need? And from that core need, create a request. So, a request has got to be Positive. You can't tell somebody what not to do because the brain doesn't listen to the no. Don't smoke. Oh, smoke. Interesting idea. Things that have no in them, we don't follow because the brain doesn't know. It's got to be positive. It's got to be measurable over the next month, once a week, or half an hour. Like a doctor's, medicine receipt. Take it after every meal. In the evening, or two weeks, and then get a refill. Meaning, the brain can only do things that it can see the beginning, the middle, and the end. If you make a request, it's got to be measurable, and it's got to be [00:16:00] specific, because with our partner, we speak secret language. They don't know what we're saying. It's got to be so specific that if a stranger found this request, they could do it. What they're learning now is the visit to go to a core need. What is my core need in the relationship? Tray by tray by tray, core need. And then to transform core need and childhood memory, because that always goes together. It's easier when the partner also then sees that little hero, needing that. Then the person designs three requests that are positive, measurable, and specific. PMS, the partner, then chooses one to actually do, and writes the other ones down because they're also important, but one to commit to, so that they can begin to do this stretching for the other. And they do that on both sides. 

Hedy Schleifer: After that, we do one session that is exploration. What it is [00:17:00] I'm inviting you to come to visit me. I don't know which neighborhood I'm going to talk to you about, but when you get there, I'll look at you, and where I land, I'll trust it. And I'll explore it. And so, we do that on both sides. The last session is what now? 

Hedy Schleifer: We've learned and we know how to cross the bridge and how do we transfer all of this into our life? It's an exploration by a visit over the bridge. When Hedy is not present, she's not guiding, she's not smiling at us, she's not doing all the Hedy stuff. How do we then continue? I recommend they create a little sanctuary in their home, a corner that has two chairs that always are across from each other, so they always see the space between. The picture of 

the kids are there, a candle, two glasses for water, and that they pass by the sanctuary. Sometimes even sit there by themselves, put the two journals there and then do a visit a week, with [00:18:00] one host, one visitor, and then write, learning, relearning, just like we've done, create that little sanctuary in your home. 

Hedy Schleifer: And then the one thing I love doing with them in the last session is based on the book of Gary Chapman, The Five Languages of Love, but to do it with a visit. So, they alternate and they visit each other. They guess what might be the partner's love language. They visit each other and now they know so much about each other. They really get it, why that is a love language and why the grownup wants it, but the kid needs it. We do it really because it's just a lot of fun. And that's the last session. 

MJ Murray Vachon LCSW: Wow. It's really a 20-hour process I would say, reclaiming one's essence. 

Hedy Schleifer: Completely.
MJ Murray Vachon LCSW: Because that gets beat out of us. Yeah. Whether 

literally or figuratively.
Hedy Schleifer: Reclaiming one's [00:19:00] essence in deep connection. MJ Murray Vachon LCSW: I'm speechless. In your best way. 

Hedy Schleifer: You really listened very deeply. I told you; you just have such a vast space inside of you and you listen from there and it's a pleasure to talk to you as a result. You're a real visitor and you land. You've landed with me. And you've learned even my rhythm and my language and you've really been with me. 

MJ Murray Vachon LCSW: There were probably five times that I actually thought you were coming to the screen because you're so present. I have not had that experience on Zoom before. You have such a powerful essence that it does transcend screens. You actually model what you're helping people create just because you're so connected to your essence. 

Hedy Schleifer: Yes, you're right. [00:20:00] Yes. 

MJ Murray Vachon LCSW: Because often as therapists, We are our main tool. We don't get to bring in lots of bells and whistles. There's a few, right? It's the essence of who we are that we bring in to try to connect with people. 

Hedy Schleifer: Yes. 

MJ Murray Vachon LCSW: Can you talk a little bit about this concept of polluted space? You were the first person I've ever heard say this. I think I heard it on one of your YouTubes, but boy, do I know what you mean when you say it, but I think you should talk about that. 

Hedy Schleifer: In the first 13 minutes, the couple does their tough talk. The space gets polluted and I name it for them. I ask, does the waiter like coming to that couple's table? And they will say, no, oh my gosh, it's toxic. Where is the toxicity? In the space, simply that's the very beginning there. The couple already begins to see. So, I explain Later when we talk about it, I say, we're responsible for the space [00:21:00] because in the survival dance, we pollute the space. It becomes toxic. The waiter doesn't even want to come to that table to refill the water. He can see there is water to be refilled, but he's shying away from that table because of the toxicity. When we are not honoring the space, when we are not crossing the bridge and creating that encounter, when we enter into the dance of survival, we pollute the space. And we've polluted the space on our planet in a million ways, and we want to clean it up, but wars pollute. I have this very big dream, really, that we will clean the space. It will be sacred. It is sacred, but we will hold it sacred and clean that space. That first session, that's nonverbal. The couple gets a sense of the space because they haven't said a word, but wow, it got so rich in [00:22:00] there. They know the difference. And then we say sometimes, look at that compared to the Wygelians space that was polluted 

MJ Murray Vachon LCSW: two words, polluted space. It's such a powerful concept the reason I wanted to come back to it is once people hear it, then I believe they're more aware of it. It's our job to keep our space between each other, between ourself, not polluted. 

Hedy Schleifer: It's our job and responsibility when 100 percent it's not like I'll do 50 and you'll do 50. It's 100 percent each person's responsibility. 

MJ Murray Vachon LCSW: Yes. 

Hedy Schleifer: How will I make sure the space between us stays rich today is a very important question. What will I put in it? Appreciation, gratitude, delight, love, what will I put in it? 

MJ Murray Vachon LCSW: Attention. Attention. Yep.
Hedy Schleifer: Like you go to Neel and you're [00:23:00] continuously 

putting amazing stuff into space between you. 

MJ Murray Vachon LCSW: Yes, the first time I met him, I stayed for five weeks, and the day before I left, I was holding him, and I got so sad that I was leaving. I wasn't sobbing, I just felt sad, and all of a sudden, he teared up. And I was like, Oh my gosh, that's mirror neurons. They weren't lying to us. I didn't say anything to him. He didn't know I was leaving the next day. I was going to be replaced by another grandparent who loved him equally. Then I noticed that space between us I try to be intentional and I try to be present. It's really powerful, and I want to thank you for that because I think it made a difference in how I interacted with people. It made me very intentional, not just [00:24:00] with my family, but also with my clients to make sure I leave the one client, I go to the bathroom, I wash my hands, usually pretty excited to see the next person so it's not a hard transition. I try to come back and be really present. I have always done that, but I did it with a different spirit after I heard your concept. 

Hedy Schleifer: To bring your full presence, focused, intentional, complete to the person, to the new space between. 

MJ Murray Vachon LCSW: Yes. We talked about this when we met a couple of weeks ago, with the presence of the phones that are actually created and wired to have our attention go there. This process that you're doing is so important that many people, they've lost it or I think some of the young people I've worked with really have had very little presence [00:25:00] because most of their conversations are over text with people. 

Hedy Schleifer: The nonverbal, which is such a piece of it, is so important to practice. Every session starts the nonverbal establishment of the bridge. Every session with that same idea of, hold hands, look at each other, begin to visualize the bridge, close your eyes, go to your hands, that same ritual of nonverbal, here I am with you, here you are with me. 

MJ Murray Vachon LCSW: How often do you work with couples where they're just one foot away from divorce or separating? 

Hedy Schleifer: The couples who choose to work with me after meeting me know that I have a structure, they know the structure, I tell them all about it. Sometimes what happens is that when they put their dreams out there, the three deep longings, aspirations, they're not compatible. It happens. And then it's the same [00:26:00] process, but the purpose is different. Can we bring these aspirations that are so different into one relationship? Or is it time to actually say goodbye? A very beautiful goodbye that is over the bridge. You invite your partner, all the beautiful and wonderful things that I say goodbye to, and all the difficult things I say goodbye, and then all the dreams and aspirations I say goodbye to. They do it very consciously, like host and visitor. I have found that when couples say a goodbye of this caliber of consciousness, they sometimes say then let's say a new hello. 

MJ Murray Vachon LCSW: That would make sense. 

Hedy Schleifer: Say a new hello. Now that we've said goodbye to all of that and we now know how to connect, let's do a new hello. And then we start the journey of hello. 

MJ Murray Vachon LCSW: This must also transform their relationships with their children. 

Hedy Schleifer: [00:27:00] Totally. Yes. Totally. 

MJ Murray Vachon LCSW: Because in the U. S. right now, we have it inverted. We have the couple's energy goes primarily to the children. On the podcast that you listened to that I did with Elly Wynia we talked about growing up, our parents went out every Saturday night and they had all these clubs and they were middle class, midwestern people. It wasn't that they lived in New York City and had this fabulous social life, but they had a very separate life from my sisters and brothers and I. For whatever reason, that is not how most families live today in the U. S. To bring the couple back to being central to each other, it must be transformative for the family. 

Hedy Schleifer: Yes, and every session they look at the big picture of the kids, and the dog and the cat and the bird, whoever is in the space, the picture is there. They know they're being watched; your children are watching you, 

MJ Murray Vachon LCSW: Is there anything [00:28:00] else you want to say that people listening would benefit from? You have so much wisdom. 

Hedy Schleifer: It's so funny. My 17-year-old grandson, Leo, said to me the other day, Bobby, have you always been that wise? Oh. I said, no. Wisdom It really grows as you mature, as you connect more deeply, as you learn. But it was such a sweet thing for you to check in with me on that. Have you always been so wise? 

Hedy Schleifer: Is there something else I want to say? What I do want to say is that all of us humans have that capacity, deep, mature connection. We have it. It's a muscle though, and with each visit over the bridge as a host, as a visitor, we stretch that muscle, and so it deepens, it strengthens, and our capacity for relationship grows, [00:29:00] and then it grows everywhere with everyone. 

Hedy Schleifer: There's been a wonderful research on longevity, and they discovered that the second most important was, do you have a small circle of the people to whom you really can say everything and they're there for you? But number one was, and that was an enormous surprise to me, are you part of the fiber of the fabric of your neighborhood? The person at the supermarket, the person at the cleaners, the hardware shop. Do you have connections as a fabric, as a social fabric? People who have those live longer. 

MJ Murray Vachon LCSW: I totally believe that. Yes. I have a friend who will live to be 200. She is a super connector with, everyone. I think of myself as a connector until I think of her. She is a [00:30:00] super connector . It doesn't matter where; she knows them on a deep level. And she's a beautiful thing. 

Hedy Schleifer: My intention is I would like to be a hundred.
MJ Murray Vachon LCSW: You will make a hundred. No doubt. 

Hedy Schleifer: But it's interesting. She is a connector at a deep level. And so, her fabric. The fabric of connection with everyone is deep and strong. 

MJ Murray Vachon LCSW: Yes. 

Hedy Schleifer: It was number one. It wasn't that circle. That circle was number two. It could be a husband there, the children there, family there, deep friendship there. Number one was what your friend gets and does. 

MJ Murray Vachon LCSW: Post pandemic, many of those were broken. And how we shopped changed. People have things delivered; they have Amazon. Clothes aren't dry cleaned so much anymore, all those relationships. I had a lot of rituals prior to the pandemic of getting my coffee from these baristas, and I knew them [00:31:00] all and I loved them all. Yes. Oh, you and your boyfriend broke up. I'm so sorry. And then it all stopped. 

Hedy Schleifer: Wow. What an important realization. And that's true. And reestablishing it so important. If we really want longevity, and I do, I would like to be around, a lot of the time. 

MJ Murray Vachon LCSW: That is connected to the mental wellness theme of my podcast. People often think, Oh, I need to go away for a week. I need a retreat. I need a spa day. Sometimes I think, no, you just need to talk to the barista. You need to ask the person at the supermarket, how are you? When we bring ourselves out of ourselves, we almost automatically feel better. And so, it's this really interesting yin yang. These are tertiary relationships; I think Esther Perl calls them. But you're also highlighting that this is the second level are these close relationships. And we need both. 

Hedy Schleifer: And we do. [00:32:00] Yeah. 

MJ Murray Vachon LCSW: We have to learn how to be close because it gets lost. My grandson's got it down. He knows how to do it, but that doesn't mean he'll know how to do it when he's 10. That's what I think about your grandson. At 17, he knows closeness enough that he can say, Oh, you're wise. That's a lot of knowledge for a 17-year-old, many of them aren't around enough depth of relationship to be able to say, Oh, that's wisdom in this room with me. And that's beautiful. Thank you for doing this. I could go on forever, but you've been more than generous with your time. I probably will not edit any of this. I'll probably just do the space fillers or whatever and be done with it. And people can listen to the whole thing. It was just amazing. 

Hedy Schleifer: I'm so glad I had a chance to just spend this time with you. This rich [00:33:00] time. 

Hedy Schleifer: Thank you, MJ. Thank you so much. 

MJ Murray Vachon LCSW: Wow! If you went back and you counted the number of times, I said, wow, in episode 66 and 67, I think you would know 

what an amazing experience has been for me. I want to thank all of you who have sent me texts and emails saying how much you loved Hedy's wisdom. 

MJ Murray Vachon LCSW: In the spirit of her generative speech. Saying what you mean in five words or less today's Inner Challenge Insights will be given to you in five words. 

Insight number one. Mental wellness. Our precious neighborhood. 

MJ Murray Vachon LCSW: 

house our essence. 

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past. 

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no. 

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positive, measurable, specific. 

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relearning learning. 

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space. 

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space? 

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essence. 

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connections. 

Insight number two. Uh, precious neighborhoods Insight number three. Better future? Mine your Insight number four.: Brain's don't connect with [00:34:00] Insight number five: make requests 

Insight number six: Know your hero's journey. Insight number seven: stretch for one another. Insight number eight. Relationships are learning, 

Insight number nine: our survival dance, pollutes Insight number 10: sacred space versus polluted Insight number 11: our full presence is our Insight number 12. Aspire to deep mature 

MJ Murray Vachon LCSW: Insight number 13: relational maturity's' lab. Is family. 

MJ Murray Vachon LCSW: Insight number 14. Longevity is befriending you're [00:35:00] barista. 

MJ Murray Vachon LCSW: Special thanks go to two people for this episode. First, Elly Wynia. Elly is a licensed clinical social worker who is trained and worked with Hedy and she made the introduction, which made these two episodes possible. Thank you so much, Elly your generosity is deeply appreciated . You can hear my conversation with Elly in episode 57. A special thanks to my grandson, Neel I hope that I'm one of the people in your life, that helps you grow into and stay connected to your essence. . Thanks for listening and go into your week and find your precious neighborhood. This is your Inner [00:36:00] Challenge.